The Nunes Memo

[Aimless]

This is absolutely grassley:

https://www.justsecurity.org/51956/d...a-application/

[Loki]

You realize the dossier was the intelligence, right? Steele included claims he thought were credible. He didn't have the resources to follow up on most of those claims. That would be up to a national intelligence agency. And ours spooked Steele when it said there was no evidence of Russian involvement in the election.

[Lewkowski]

You realize the dossier was the intelligence, right? Steele included claims he thought were credible. He didn't have the resources to follow up on most of those claims. That would be up to a national intelligence agency. And ours spooked Steele when it said there was no evidence of Russian involvement in the election.

IE rumors.

[Aimless]

Raw intelligence that was taken seriously because it corroborated evidence the FBI had obtained by other means. You're really embarrassing yourself.

[GGT]

Trump refuses to release the Democrat's 'opposing' memo, citing security concerns. But he released the Nunes/GOP memo against the FBI's 'grave concerns' about the same thing? Seriously?

[Aimless]

As expected, the minority memo--the release of which was delayed by WH until Saturday night to minimize coverage--directly and persuasively refutes central claims of the Nunes memo.

[GGT]

OMG, both "memos" are political documents. They only reflect our polarization, and won't change a damn thing.

[Aimless]

Yes, facts are political these days.

[Aimless]

Intel committee leaking witness testimony to all the right people:

https://amp.cnn.com/cnn/2018/03/06/p...nce/index.html

[LittleFuzzy]

You know what would really, really make me happy? If the Mueller investigation managed to uncover something worth indicting Nunes on.

[Loki]

You know what would really, really make me happy? If the Mueller investigation managed to uncover something worth indicting Nunes on.

It would be time to create a Church of Mueller.

[Aimless]

No Fuzzy, we can't have good things.

[Aimless]

In shocking plot twist, recently released (albeit heavily redacted) FISA documents show Nunes & co. were lying, eg. when they claimed a Yahoo article based on info from Steele was used to corroborate Steele's dossier. Will there be any criticism from within the GOP? Will there be any calls for resignation? Will there be any apologies?

Of course not. This is not a responsible party. They have no integrity and they are currently unfit to govern.

[Aimless]

Review:

https://mobile.twitter.com/pwnallthe...00152926384128

(long thread)

Conclusion: Nunes lied, with the help of Gowdy and other Republicans, and then tried to hide the truth. And at least one person on this forum was happy to cheer these scummy fuckers on.

[Steely Glint]

I think what's most notable is not the fact of the lie, but what they're lying in aid of.

Normally, when politicians lie it's to conceal something that makes them look bad or some piece of information that goes counter to their ideological leanings. Not exactly commendable, but at least understandable.

This is something else. Whatever they're up to, they're not looking out for the interests of their country or the people they're supposed to represent.

[Aimless]

But this does make them look bad. This makes the entire republican party look bad, and what they don't realize is that their attempts at covering things up—in order to deprive their liberal opponents of ammunition—only makes them look worse. The entire GOP establishment has gone all in on Trump not because they too are Russian assets but because they saw the storm coming and thought they could ride it out without tearing their country apart and setting themselves up for humiliation, and maybe even get a tax cut out of it. They thought Trump couldn't be all that bad and that they could control him, and now they can't cut him loose.

[Lewkowski]

Oh my.

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2018...docs-show.html

"On four occasions, the FBI told the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance (FISA) court that it "did not believe" former British spy Christopher Steele was the direct source for a Yahoo News article implicating former Trump aide Carter Page in Russian collusion, newly released documents reveal.

Instead, the FBI suggested to the court, the September 2016 article by Michael Isikoff was independent corroboration of the salacious, unverified allegations against Trump in the infamous Steele Dossier. Federal authorities used both the Steele Dossier and Yahoo News article to convince the FISA court to authorize a surveillance warrant for Page."

.....

"Critics have charged that Deputy Attorney General Rod Rosenstein, who signed off on the FISA application renewals, should not have approved them without more reliable intelligence."

A YAHOO NEWS ARTICLE WAS USED AS EVIDENCE TO OBTAIN A FISA WARRANT??? Holy fucking shit, serious?

[Steely Glint]

A YAHOO NEWS ARTICLE WAS USED AS EVIDENCE TO OBTAIN A FISA WARRANT??? Holy fucking shit, serious?

No, that's not what the warrant says. Fox News are bullshitting you.

https://int.nyt.com/data/documenthel.../optimized.pdf (pages 22 through 26)

The warrant mentions the September 23rd Article in the context (C O N T E X T) of Page's later denial of those accusations, and the Trump campaign's subsequent distancing of themselves from him, and saying he's nothing to do with the campaign. It does not offer it as corroboration or evidence, merely as background for something else they think is important. Why they mention Page's denial specifically is hard to tell because everything before and after is blacked out.

Instead, the FBI suggested to the court, the September 2016 article by Michael Isikoff was independent corroboration of the salacious, unverified allegations against Trump in the infamous Steele Dossier. Federal authorities used both the Steele Dossier and Yahoo News article to convince the FISA court to authorize a surveillance warrant for Page.

I haven't read the entire thing, but this appears to be flat out bollocks. The warrant makes no mention of the September article in the context of the Steele dossier that I could find. The link is right up there if anyone wants to prove me wrong.

[Loki]

Funny how you start caring about the rights of the acused when they're conservative white men.

[Lewkowski]

Funny how you start caring about the rights of the acused when they're conservative white men.

Outside of not supporting giving constitutional rights to non-citizens when have I ever dismissed the rights of the accused?

But so back to the Yahoo article = evidence. Do you actually support this? Should the Koch brothers buy Yahoo and just start using their articles as reason for a Trump to surveil the DNC and all Democrats?

[Aimless]

Funny how you start caring about the rights of the acused when they're conservative white men.

I can't stop laughing at how bad that state media article is, or how Lewk swallowed it hook, line and sinker. The documents show the opposite of what the article says it does and I suspect the dumbass who wrote it got his talking points from someone else trying to muddy the waters. The redacted portions contain even more damning material.

[Aimless]

It is bollocks. The article in question is cited, along with another article, to demonstrate that Page publicly denied his Russian connections, which the FBI at that point knew was false. In addition, the document clearly states that the Yahoo article probably made use of info that had been obtained by Steele, which is basically the opposite of using it to corroborate Steele's findings.

Honestly, this is so fucking embarrassing that lewk would almost be justified in deleting that post.

[Steely Glint]

So I found the article Fox News is on about.

https://www.yahoo.com/news/u-s-intel...l?guccounter=1

Notice anything? Like, what it's actually reporting... it is reporting that US intelligence officials are investigating Carter Page.

Fox News reckons:

Instead, the FBI suggested to the court, the September 2016 article by Michael Isikoff was independent corroboration of the salacious, unverified allegations against Trump in the infamous Steele Dossier. Federal authorities used both the Steele Dossier and Yahoo News article to convince the FISA court to authorize a surveillance warrant for Page.

So according to Fox News, the FBI was using an article saying that they themselves were investigating Page was corroboration of the Steele dossier. That the investigation was kicked off by an article reporting on the existence of that investigation and they used the article reporting the fact they were investigating as evidence to get a warrant which can only be proof that FBI investigative procedure makes used of closed time-like curves and what the shitting hell is this Doctor Who level bollocks honest to christ

[Lewkowski]

So I found the article Fox News is on about.

https://www.yahoo.com/news/u-s-intel...l?guccounter=1

Notice anything? Like, what it's actually reporting... it is reporting that US intelligence officials are investigating Carter Page.

Fox News reckons:



So according to Fox News, the FBI was using an article saying that they themselves were investigating Page was corroboration of the Steele dossier. That the investigation was kicked off by an article reporting on the existence of that investigation and they used the article reporting the fact they were investigating as evidence to get a warrant which can only be proof that FBI investigative procedure makes used of closed time-like curves and what the shitting hell is this Doctor Who level bollocks honest to christ

What was used to justify the FISA warrant outside of the Steele Dossier?

[Aimless]

What was used to justify the FISA warrant outside of the Steele Dossier?

Most of this info remains redacted, with only the relevant statutes noted in the apps.

However, it begins like this:



(with the redacted content--likely providing increasingly detailed information about those contacts w/ Russian intelligence--growing in size for each app)

And continues like this:



Transcript of intercepted convos between two SVR officers talking about Page:





As for the Steele memos, the FBI was and remains satisfied that Steele is a reliable source, but of course they went to great lengths to provide independent corroboration. The Schiff memo points out that the FBI's counterintelligence investigation was initiated nearly two months before they received Steele's intel, based on other information that was available to them:

https://www.politico.com/f/?id=00000...1-edefe9d00001

• Christopher Steele's raw intelligence reporting did not inform the rave decision to initiate its counterintelligence investigation in late July 2016. In fact, the FBI's closely-held investigative team only received Steele's reopening in mid-September—more than seven weeks later. The FBI – and, subsequently, the Special Counsel's – investigation into links between the Russian government and Trump campaign associates has been based on troubling law enforcement and intelligence information unrelated to the "dossier."

• DOJ's October 21, 2016 FISA application and three subsequent renewals carefully outlined for the court a multi-pronged rationale for surveilling Page, who, at the time of the first application, was no longer with the Trump campaign. DOJ detailed Page's past relationships with Russian spies and interaction with Russian officials during the 2016 campaign, . DOJ cited multiple sources to support the case for surveilling Page—but made only narrow use or information from Steele's sources about Page's specific activities in 2016, chiefly his suspected July 2016 meetings in Moscow with Russian officials. . In fact, the FBI interviewed Page in March 2016 about his contact with Russian intelligence. the very month candidate Donald Trump named him a foreign policy adviser.

As DOJ informed the Court in subsequent renewals, Steele's reporting about Page's Moscow meetings . DOJ's applications did not otherwise rely on Steele's reporting, including any "salacious" allegations about Trump, and the FBI never paid Steele for this reporting. While explaining why the FBI viewed Steele's reporting and sources as reliable and credible, DOJ also disclosed:

• Steele's prior relationship with the FBI;
• the fact of and reason for his termination as a source; and
• the assessed political motivation of those who hired him.

The FISA applications contain redacted sections that describe this information.

Now you might chafe at the thought of having to take Schiff's word on anything, but let's be clear: we now know that Nunes lied about the contents of the FISA apps, and we have confirmed that some of Schiff's corrections were accurate.

In closing, I must confess that I find the striking differences between your views on govt. surveillance of brown Muslim Americans (who might hold extremist views) and a non-Muslim white American (who has had suspicious contacts with intelligence officers of a hostile foreign nation and is strongly suspected of having committed numerous criminal violations of US statutes)... to be pretty hilarious. You're turning into a parody of yourself, Lewk.

[Lewkowski]

Aimless - so all of that is... jack and shit without more parts being un-redacted. Let me ask you this - without the Steele Dossier would that FISA warrant been issued or was it the critical part of the justification for it? This is important because if it is the critical part and they did not disclose the details tot he FISA court about the obvious bias nature of it you have proof of some real shady shit in an election year.

Secondly lets talk about this:

"In closing, I must confess that I find the striking differences between your views on govt. surveillance of brown Muslim Americans (who might hold extremist views) and a non-Muslim white American (who has had suspicious contacts with intelligence officers of a hostile foreign nation and is strongly suspected of having committed numerous criminal violations of US statutes)... to be pretty hilarious. You're turning into a parody of yourself, Lewk."

Monitoring PUBLIC FACEBOOK PAGES DOESN'T REQUIRE A WARRANT. In addition if you did want to push the envelope, I'd rather have people looking into actual terrorist threats then random spy games.

[Enoch the Red]

Aimless - so all of that is... jack and shit without more parts being un-redacted. Let me ask you this - without the Steele Dossier would that FISA warrant been issued or was it the critical part of the justification for it? This is important because if it is the critical part and they did not disclose the details tot he FISA court about the obvious bias nature of it you have proof of some real shady shit in an election year.

Secondly lets talk about this:

"In closing, I must confess that I find the striking differences between your views on govt. surveillance of brown Muslim Americans (who might hold extremist views) and a non-Muslim white American (who has had suspicious contacts with intelligence officers of a hostile foreign nation and is strongly suspected of having committed numerous criminal violations of US statutes)... to be pretty hilarious. You're turning into a parody of yourself, Lewk."

Monitoring PUBLIC FACEBOOK PAGES DOESN'T REQUIRE A WARRANT. In addition if you did want to push the envelope, I'd rather have people looking into actual terrorist threats then random spy games.

Haven't you advocated for placing surveillance on mosques?

[Ominous Gamer]

I'd rather have people looking into actual terrorist threats then random spy games.

Translation: I'm a fucking moron.

[Aimless]

So I found the article Fox News is on about.

https://www.yahoo.com/news/u-s-intel...l?guccounter=1

Notice anything? Like, what it's actually reporting... it is reporting that US intelligence officials are investigating Carter Page.

Fox News reckons:



So according to Fox News, the FBI was using an article saying that they themselves were investigating Page was corroboration of the Steele dossier. That the investigation was kicked off by an article reporting on the existence of that investigation and they used the article reporting the fact they were investigating as evidence to get a warrant which can only be proof that FBI investigative procedure makes used of closed time-like curves and what the shitting hell is this Doctor Who level bollocks honest to christ

A more important issue is that Nunes & co. lied about how the article was used. They claimed that the article was used to corroborate Steele's intel even though it was itself based on that same intel. The Schiff memo attempted to correct this lie:



We now know that Nunes & co. lied; the article was used to show that Page was lying about his Russian contacts:



This is important b/c Page was in effect working as a foreign agent while hiding that fact, by not registering as one and publicly denying that status.

Lewk is now defending the grotesque attempt to protect Trump by obstructing the FBI's work and calling the agency into disrepute through the use of outright lies. It is utterly disgraceful that he cannot acknowledge that Nunes lied about the contents of the FISA app & reauths even when presented with conclusive evidence that this was the case, just as it was when they claimed that the FBI did not disclose the ultimately political nature of Steele's funding & assignment and later when they claimed that the disclosure was too difficult to notice (it was a footnote that covered half a fucking page). These people are irredeemable. They're "owning the libs" by acting like delusional idiots.

[Steely Glint]

The underlying logic of trying to tie the FBI's investigation to the Steele Dossier ("The Steele Dossier is unverified, so the FBI shouldn't seek to verify it!") is a fairly significant tell that the people pushing that angle are not operating in good faith.