What the hell is libertarianism?

[GGT]

Take a nap, Tear. Really. You sound.....what's the word.....unusually combative.

Speaking of smells. Since my son moved back home the other day, there's a lingering odor of smelly feet-sweat-shampoo-hormones-incense-pot-pizza. It's really strange and rather nauseating.

[LittleFuzzy]

I don't exactly see what I did to warrant that comment (and a couple of others) that were way beyond the pale of what has gone before.

You think anyone gives a shit whether your responses are proportionate to the other's, at this late date? You burned your bridges on this topic long ago.

[littlelolligagged]

You think anyone gives a shit whether your responses are proportionate to the other's, at this late date? You burned your bridges on this topic long ago.

Listen to Fuzzball, he's saying what everyone is thinking.

[Steely Glint]

I don't exactly see what I did to warrant that comment (and a couple of others) that were way beyond the pale of what has gone before.

You know what Cain is like and how he reacts to things. What exactly did you think was going to happen if you constantly follow him round and flame him in ever single thread he posts in? He was going to say "Wow, Tear, you're right! I am a reprehensible human being for saying all those things about you, and also for the other mean things I said to other people. I will mend my ways immediately."? If you really thought that was going to happen then you're delusional, if you didn't then what exactly did you think you were going to achieve?

[Loki]

Really? Personal attacks?

Loki, go lie somewhere where they don't smell it for what it is.

Which part of that post was a personal attack? Or are you defining a personal attack as anything that's not laudatory of you?

[']['ear]

You know what Cain is like and how he reacts to things. What exactly did you think was going to happen if you constantly follow him round and flame him in ever single thread he posts in? He was going to say "Wow, Tear, you're right! I am a reprehensible human being for saying all those things about you, and also for the other mean things I said to other people. I will mend my ways immediately."? If you really thought that was going to happen then you're delusional, if you didn't then what exactly did you think you were going to achieve?

Look, ass, I wasn't following Cain and flaming him. I have as much right as anybody here to post in threads. Oh no, did I dare say something Cain disagreed with?

That's really nice, man. Because we've got a history of arguing, he has magical dispensation to say heinously evil things? How, exactly, is he different that Silverlink. Silver, too, was angry at me when he wished for my kidney disease to kill me. Did that excuse his behavior? No. And that's what you're doing: you're excusing the extreme Cain when to "just because he's angry." That's not an excuse, Steely, and shame on you for trying to make it.

[']['ear]

Which part of that post was a personal attack? Or are you defining a personal attack as anything that's not laudatory of you?

"Oh, you weren't around for that? Apparently our dear ][ear was drafted to fight in Nicaragua. Well, so he claimed, anyway. I guess "believe what I say about the military because I was a Contra" was more convincing than "believe what I say about the military because I'm a cum-guzzling coward whose closest experience to combat was getting renal failure from an untreated STD I picked up being gay-for-pay near the local military base."

Dunno man. Is that a personal attack. Seems, um, less than laudatory of me, yes.

[Loki]

Look, ass, I wasn't following Cain and flaming him. I have as much right as anybody here to post in threads. Oh no, did I dare say something Cain disagreed with?

[']['ear]

You do it all the time. So? Double standard? I have the right to be wound up with him when Cain tells me my kidney disease was a self-inflicted disease, and Steely responds that it's my fault and it's all OK.

Horse shit, Loki. How do you look in the mirror every morning?

[Steely Glint]

Look, ass, I wasn't following Cain and flaming him.

That's sure as hell what it looks like you're doing.

That's really nice, man. Because we've got a history of arguing, he has magical dispensation to say heinously evil things? How, exactly, is he different that Silverlink. Silver, too, was angry at me when he wished for my kidney disease to kill me. Did that excuse his behavior? No. And that's what you're doing: you're excusing the extreme Cain when to "just because he's angry." That's not an excuse, Steely, and shame on you for trying to make it.

I'm not excusing his behavior any more than I'm excusing yours. You've both be responsible for escalating and prolonging this insipid vendetta, and suddenly you're angry because the next escalation crossed a line you're not comfortable with? You and your stupid pride and grudges are just as responsible for this situation as he is, and we're all so fucking sick of clicking on any given thread and seeing you too flaming each other over stuff noone gives a shit about to actually bother getting offended over this latest 'outrage'.

[']['ear]

Take a nap, Tear. Really. You sound.....what's the word.....unusually combative.

Trying to imagine a comparable insult to you. Put yourself in my shoes. You wouldn't be enraged? I don't recall anything close to this ever coming your way (it would have been an instant permaban in CC. In fact, it was.)

[Loki]

Have you considered the remote possibility that insulting virtually everyone you come in contact with here is not the best way to garner sympathy?

[']['ear]

That's sure as hell what it looks like you're doing.

Then you have no idea what was going on. Cain just doesn't like anti-libertarian cartoons. I posted that in the libertarian thread, and that's what precipitated his comment. See Chaloobi's response as proof. Cain had no excuse, he just knew he would get away with it because y'all are spineless.

I'm not excusing his behavior any more than I'm excusing yours. You've both be responsible for escalating and prolonging this insipid vendetta, and suddenly you're angry because the next escalation crossed a line you're not comfortable with? You and your stupid pride and grudges are just as responsible for this situation as he is, and we're all so fucking sick of clicking on any given thread and seeing you too flaming each other over stuff noone gives a shit about to actually bother getting offended over this latest 'outrage'.

1) There's a difference between people arguing and abomination posts. I may be guilty of the former, but not the latter. And don't you dare insinuate that I do.

2) There's a qualitative difference. If that kind of comment was enough to have Silver banned and for Dread to chase him off when he poked his nose in here, then a comment that is much worse deserves the same punishment.

3) In the past I don't ask for Cain to be banned because of anything he has said to me. I supported a ban for trying to get suicidal kids to off themselves. Mea culpa, man. I'd do exactly the same thing over again.

[GGT]

You think anyone gives a shit whether your responses are proportionate to the other's, at this late date? You burned your bridges on this topic long ago.

I care. I hope he's not in the middle of organ rejection. Really. You guys have no idea how steroids or anti-rejection drugs can influence behavior.

[LittleFuzzy]

Look, ass, I wasn't following Cain and flaming him.

Are delusions part of your illness, now?

[']['ear]

What, a cartoon joking libertarians in a libertarian thread?

Fuzzy, I've long been mystified by the utter lack of censure of Cain from you. For a man professing to be a ethical Christian, it is baffling. But hey, as long as he doesn't say that your personal hell was caused by prostituting yourself and thus self-inflicting, eh? Maybe that's why you're quiet: you're cowed.

[CitizenCain]

It is rather curious to observe a psychopath in action. A pathologically lying psychopath.

Oh, well, as a peace offering, I'll mail you a mirror. I just need you to give me your address.

Why the need to mock my illness, Cain?

I don't need to, I can quit any time I want to. I just don't want to.

Is it really different than the Westboro baptist church? Having fun with the suffering of others?

It is. I have to get to know someone and figure out that they're particularly vile example of humanity before I enjoy their suffering. With the Westboro Baptist Church, I think it's more of a hating homos thing. And straight soldiers... and possibly anyone who doesn't hate gays. Actually, I think they just kinda hate everyone.

What kind of person does that? What kind of sickness thrives on that? Do you kill people? Torture? Rape? What is the boundary of your enjoyment of others' suffering? Where do you draw the line, man? We know that you will try to taunt suicidal tweens into killing themswelves.

You know, as was said at the time, and has been said by many different people since... an attention-whoring emo is not actually suicidal, but it's fun to treat them like they are.

I've witnessed more than once. Most of us here have. So how reprehensible are you, really?

I am evil incarnate.

Feel better about yourself now? Standing up to pure evil, for the sake of all that is good and holy, and not just because you're an overgrown, narcissistic little child having a temper tantrum?

I'll tell you a little secret, and by secret, I mean something a two year old could figure out, about Cain: he likes it when you do stuff like that.

If he was capable of learning, or you know, hearing anything he disagrees with, I'd be be worried about you spoiling my fun.

Hence the little joke I posted: this is obviously not about bear hunting.

You mean that disgusting, homophobic promotion of anal rape? You should be banned for that.

What, a cartoon joking libertarians in a libertarian thread?

Fuzzy, I've long been mystified by the utter lack of censure of Cain from you. For a man professing to be a ethical Christian, it is baffling. But hey, as long as he doesn't say that your personal hell was caused by prostituting yourself and thus self-inflicting, eh? Maybe that's why you're quiet: you're cowed.

It must be that Fuzzy's a homophobe too. Obviously, only a closet homophobe could be unoffended by my blatant bigotry, therefore, Fuzzy must be homophobic. Wait, we're banning for that now, aren't we?

[']['ear]

Oh, well, as a peace offering, I'll mail you a mirror. I just need you to give me your address.



I don't need to, I can quit any time I want to. I just don't want to.



It is. I have to get to know someone and figure out that they're particularly vile example of humanity before I enjoy their suffering. With the Westboro Baptist Church, I think it's more of a hating homos thing. And straight soldiers... and possibly anyone who doesn't hate gays. Actually, I think they just kinda hate everyone.



You know, as was said at the time, and has been said by many different people since... an attention-whoring emo is not actually suicidal, but it's fun to treat them like they are.



I am evil incarnate.

Feel better about yourself now? Standing up to pure evil, for the sake of all that is good and holy, and not just because you're an overgrown, narcissistic little child having a temper tantrum?



If he was capable of learning, or you know, hearing anything he disagrees with, I'd be be worried about you spoiling my fun.



You mean that disgusting, homophobic promotion of anal rape? You should be banned for that.



It must be that Fuzzy's a homophobe too. Obviously, only a closet homophobe could be unoffended by my blatant bigotry, therefore, Fuzzy must be homophobic. Wait, we're banning for that now, aren't we?

No, Fuzzy is just a coward. He won't criticize you.

You, you're just psychopathic troll.

[CitizenCain]

No, Fuzzy is just a coward. He won't criticize you.

Actually it's probably more related to his ability to learn. I'll let him try to explain it to you for the 5th fucking time if he wants to.

[Nessus]

Hurt feelings in a thread about someone's political ideology? It's more likely than you think!

Alternative punchline: I love the smell of the old CC in the morning

[Loki]

Soon you'll be smelling ash.

[Nessus]

If you say so, herr Doktor

[Aimless]

Okay, is it possible to have a functioning and productive society that includes both libertarians and non-libertarians??

[Aimless]

Some more questions... what are libertarian takes on:

1. the rights and responsibilities of parents towards their children

2. the rights of children

3. the rights of physically and/or mentally disabled persons (apart from anecdotes about eg. this one handicapped guy who wrote books about computers )

4. establishing and maintaining a military force

5. the mission of that military force

??

[EyeKhan]

Children...

No. Might feel like it sometimes, but no. Not in a scientific sense.

I would say the parasites are all those who deprive others of wealth or liberty through forcible compulsion (directly or by proxy). So, basically government and (to a lesser extent) the beneficiaries of government's ill-gotten wealth.

Are you an anarchist?

Enh. Like I said the first time ][ear posted that... libertarians object to forcible compulsion (give us money or go to jail) and not the offer of a service (in exchange for $x, we'll protect your house from fires).

Do you object to civilization in general? Seriously, you realize all that compulsory money pays for civlization, the technology and economic infrastructure that's provided us all with exceptional standard of living. You would give that all up so you could reduce your taxes? (I'm assuming you don't object to law enforcement, courts, the military... or do you?)

Oh, you weren't around for that? Apparently our dear ][ear was drafted to fight in Nicaragua. Well, so he claimed, anyway.

I know Tear told a lot of lies but I wasn't aware that he'd been pretending to be a Contra.

I guess "believe what I say about the military because I was a Contra" was more convincing than "believe what I say about the military because I'm a cum-guzzling coward whose closest experience to combat was getting renal failure from an untreated STD I picked up being gay-for-pay near the local military base."

Holy Moly.

[EyeKhan]

Libertarian credo? "Bottom of a bottle, on top of a woman?"

You front far more than anybody here, snake, so you should be careful about glass houses. By your own admission, you are a parasite who wants to take as much as possible from the world and give as little as possible in return. Society has put far more into you than you have returned, or ever will returned. You're a taker, not a giver. Are you libertarianisms poster child? Selfish narcissism?

You're a faker. You do nothing but posture, bully and mock. Why should any of us believe the fantabulous back story you present us? It's preposterous. You expect us to believe your Hollywood life story, Cain? None of your posting matches up. The little details are ALWAYS missing. You're nothing but talk, bro. Smoke and mirrors.

And spare me the coward talk. I've been through far more than some fantasy soldier like yourself, who never came within a hemisphere of war. As I've pointed out before, how come you never shared a single relevant detail of your war experience until I mentioned this deficit, eh? Because you had no experience to draw on, so silence was safer. You figured if you dropped a "huah" on us now and then, and refer obliquely to some historical battle, you'd stamp your soldier card.

Fuck you, coward. Your whole personna is BS fronting by some scrawny wuss. You're a disgusting excuse for a human being. You taunt people stuggling to live, and you torment suicidal tweens. Is there anything lower, other than molesting children? You're sickening. Saying things less offensive got Silverlink widely excoriated and banned. I fell confident you won't, you pustule on the ass of humanity. What makes you different from the Westboro Baptist Church, exactly? Let's see, people who died are that way because God hates fags, right? And you claim my kidneys failed because I picked up soldiers for gay sex? WELL DONE. Really, man. Way to stamp your humanity card. We all get it about you now, you evil, sick fuck.

It will be entertaining to watch TWF's powers that be rationalize how they tolerate your evil. Dread, after all, is one of the two people who can verify who I am. I sent him my information before my transplant. Serious character check here, eh?


Edit: OH NO! I forgot. You've got a computer and are well-armed! You threaten to come kill people who disagree with you on the internyets. PLEASE don't kill me Mr. Macho, armed-to-the-teeth military man! PLEASE don't kill me! I've only got 9 lives, and have used 2 up already. Please don't take my life! I'll do anything! I'm so terrified! PLEASE don't threaten me! And whatever you do, don't make homophobic jokes about me! That's so horrible!

Look, do us all a favor, go to an SF bathhouse and work out your homoerotic problems. You're fucking insufferable and offensive, you goddamned Larry Craig-emulating, repressed right-wing Republican bigot

Cain's a psychopath. That's the only term you can define with him as your archetype.

Oh, are you going to shoot me, Cain? Because you've obliquely threatened two posters with shooting recently. Oh noes!

Fuck you, Cain.

That's nice Steely. Does it make your complicity in Cain's behavior go down better, somehow?

Ladies and gentlemen, Mr. Steely Glint. Whatever he may do, he'll never take a stand, or at least not one that is discernible without carefully sifting and inferring from his posts. Bravery. Balls. Truth. That's Mr. Steely Glint.

Wow. I thought the religious right in *this* country was nutty. I should have known that they'd look sane compared to Germany. <shrug> Leave it to Europe to make liberalism look a lot like fascism.



Personal credo. Granted, it's not as clever as yours, but what is yours? "Serving the cause of liberals as a Contra since 1963?"



Well, in that case, it's possible to believe in individual liberty (politically) and still posses the ability to generalize and categorize. And it's still baffling that you don't take that as a given.



Really. Why would anyone who hates or distrusts the government... let the government raise their children?




Letting your inner communist out to play, are ya? Sorry that you find the idea of voluntary commerce to be so distasteful.



No, my parents gave me everything. Government, society, self-righteous zealots like you haven't given me anything other than a cold rage for the rest of humanity. Fuck off and die. Seriously, what a fucking waste of a perfectly good donor kidney you are. Should have gone to someone more useful, like a crack whore.



What Hollywood life story? Lower-middle class kid grows into middle class adult? Yeah, shit man, the big studios are always beating down my door to put that one up on the big screen.



Whatever you say. The jungles of Central America are beautiful this time of year, aren't they?

I *am* curious about what your obsession with war stories is, though... you hoping to pick up a detail or two to make your lies about military service better? Is your secret shame that you're a liberal who gets off on war porn? Have a big boy crush on me?



Yeah, that was pretty funny. But only because he was a drama whore with no serious intention to suicide or even self-harm. I must have a gift for smelling out a phony... probably why you've always had such a problem with me.



Aww, come on... if you're gonna do this, you gotta at least bring up my solicitation of underage DBZ kiddie porn, and pretend like I was being serious too.



Holy shit! I actually hit a nerve, didn't I? Now I'm starting to think your kidney disease really is the result of an untreated STD. Damn, I wish I could show you just how big I'm smiling right now.



He may well know your identity, but he's hardly one of the only people who know who you really are. Pretty much everyone on here knows you're a pathological liar who makes himself feel big by pretending to be anyone else. "I'm a contra! I'm an ex-Republican! I'm a born-again Christian who saw the light! I'm a rich Ph.D. with a hot wife and a fabulous home who loves paying his taxes! I'm a poor kid from the street who made it big thanks to government help!"

Seriously... how pathetic are you that you have to pretend to be someone, anyone else just to post online?



Careful now... wasn't it that kind of talk that got you the STD which fried your kidneys?





You really don't get it, do you? I couldn't give a fuck if you're gay or not... and God knows you can't swing a dead towel-head in the Army without hitting a gay guy. I'm not the one who's got a homophobia problem - you are. That's why you get worked up into a frenzy anytime I suggest you may have had gay experiences, and I care so little about it that I make gay jokes about myself. A liberal closet-homophobe. God-damn, it's fun to have you around again!



Right. For that, you should probably go to the beginning of the thread, where at least three people provided a plethora of definitions of libertarianism. (Both serious, and humorous.)



"And blackjack, and hookers! In fact, forget the blackjack!"



Exactly. What retirement plan isn't largely based in fantasy? But, for the record, this would all be financed through savings, and acquired through voluntary trade. (Buying shit with my savings.) Once I've worked long enough to afford my lifestyle, why not sit around on a beach, relaxing, playing with my toys (guns and computers and the like) and ingesting happiness in its various chemical forms? I guess that males me a man of simple tastes, or something.

But just for the record, I *will* be naked. I hate pants. Once I no longer need them to be out "in public" without getting arrested, the pants come off. This will, perhaps, be the only non-libertarian law on my island. No pants. Ever. For anyone.



Not sure about that - the natural world is every bit your "master" (at least in the sense you're using it), whether there's a government and a society around you or not. Fat lotta good that civilization does you when the tsunami's bearing down on you, and like that there.



No thanks, man. I prefer chicks. *Without* STDs.

Weren't you referring to felonies? Sounds like you prefer children. That's not a troll: you said it yourself.

It is rather curious to observe a psychopath in action. A pathologically lying psychopath. Why the need to mock my illness, Cain? Is it really different than the Westboro baptist church? Having fun with the suffering of others? What kind of person does that? What kind of sickness thrives on that? Do you kill people? Torture? Rape? What is the boundary of your enjoyment of others' suffering? Where do you draw the line, man? We know that you will try to taunt suicidal tweens into killing themswelves. I've witnessed more than once. Most of us here have. So how reprehensible are you, really?

Why would you assume that if I were to talk a stand, it would be siding with you against Cain?



I already figured it out: none whatsoever, otherwise you would have explained what it was instead of restoring to poorly disguised bluffing.

Oh, not necessarily. Really, taking any ethical stand against that kind of behavior. You see, you just want the show, so you can apply your cool, practiced cynicism.

Just out of interest, what 'ethical stand' would you like me to take? Maybe following him around to every thread he posts him telling him what a worthless fucking fuck he is?

I wonder if you notice the irony of those two statements given your recent behavior. I'll guess no, but who knows.

Yes, actually. Something like that. You see, when Silver attacked Lolli with all kinds of ugly stuff, I stepped up and took a side. When Cain tried to get the kiddies to commit suicide, I called him on it. When people have said homophobic, racist, sexist whatever, I always step up and say "you've gone too far." That's what decent people do in a community.

When Cain makes grotesque, cruel and homophobic comments about the illness that almost killed me? Nothing. Outrage when Silverlink says stuff less offensive stuff, but nothing against Cain because he is amusing where Silver was abrasive.

You see, Steely. It's not the offender, it's the offense. If you let an abomination pass without comment, you are complicit. If you here somebody drop the N-word at a party and just turn away in discomfort, you are complicit. You are, in fact, ethically compromised.

Oh, well, as a peace offering, I'll mail you a mirror. I just need you to give me your address.



I don't need to, I can quit any time I want to. I just don't want to.



It is. I have to get to know someone and figure out that they're particularly vile example of humanity before I enjoy their suffering. With the Westboro Baptist Church, I think it's more of a hating homos thing. And straight soldiers... and possibly anyone who doesn't hate gays. Actually, I think they just kinda hate everyone.



You know, as was said at the time, and has been said by many different people since... an attention-whoring emo is not actually suicidal, but it's fun to treat them like they are.



I am evil incarnate.

Feel better about yourself now? Standing up to pure evil, for the sake of all that is good and holy, and not just because you're an overgrown, narcissistic little child having a temper tantrum?



If he was capable of learning, or you know, hearing anything he disagrees with, I'd be be worried about you spoiling my fun.



You mean that disgusting, homophobic promotion of anal rape? You should be banned for that.



It must be that Fuzzy's a homophobe too. Obviously, only a closet homophobe could be unoffended by my blatant bigotry, therefore, Fuzzy must be homophobic. Wait, we're banning for that now, aren't we?

No, Fuzzy is just a coward. He won't criticize you.

You, you're just psychopathic troll.

Actually it's probably more related to his ability to learn. I'll let him try to explain it to you for the 5th fucking time if he wants to.

(Been waiting a while for the most ideal opportunity to use that emoticon. Thanks guys. )

[EyeKhan]

Okay, is it possible to have a functioning and productive society that includes both libertarians and non-libertarians??

See above.

(sorry for the multi-posting guys... I figured this thread is so dysfunctional it doesn't matter...)

[Aimless]

Thank you for hiding my questions beneath that post.

[Veldan Rath]

Some more questions... what are libertarian takes on:

1. the rights and responsibilities of parents towards their children

2. the rights of children

3. the rights of physically and/or mentally disabled persons (apart from anecdotes about eg. this one handicapped guy who wrote books about computers )

4. establishing and maintaining a military force

5. the mission of that military force

??

There ya go!

[Nessus]

Thank you for hiding my questions beneath that post.

It's not like you were going to get constructive and/or honest answers, either way