No words can express the horror of this pension system.

[CitizenCain]

Last I checked slavery and indentured servitude were abolished centuries ago. Here's a simple solutionif you don't like your workplace: quit.

Sure, and new employees are free and grow on trees.

Even a minimum wage cashier jockey costs thousands of dollars to train, whereas kind words and feigned concern are free, so workplaces that actually adhere to your if-they-don't-like-it-too-fucking-bad approach to employee morale may as well be burning piles of cash on the front lawn.

FFS, aren't you a manager? How do you not know this?

*weasel word

Is that how it is, no qualifiers, because everything is black-and-white and absolute?

How Lewkowskian of you.

[Loki]

*weasel word
Doctors can be and are disbarred for falsifying conditions, they can be and are arrested for such practices. There are plenty of incentives for a doctor to do his job properly.

And people can and do win the lottery; doesn't mean it happens with any reasonable frequency.

And yet it is among the greatest work-environment problems in the Western world. It's almost as if people shouldn't be happy at work

And you're basing this on?

[Ominous Gamer]

Is that how it is, no qualifiers, because everything is black-and-white and absolute?

How Lewkowskian of you.

its more alone the lines that loki loves using these types of words when he has no factual information to back up a claim. the idea that he is trying to paint it as close as he can to being black and white without risking learning otherwise is what i'm pointing out.

And people can and do win the lottery; doesn't mean it happens with any reasonable frequency.

and you're going to claim this frequency doesn't have anything to do with the fact that doctors are honest in their diagnosis?

[Loki]

and you're going to claim this frequency doesn't have anything to do with the fact that doctors are honest in their diagnosis?

Would you dissuaded from a beneficial behavior when you always have some degree of deniability and have a higher chance of winning the lottery than of being punished?

[Ominous Gamer]

have a higher chance of winning the lottery than of being punished?

citation?

[GGT]

Even a minimum wage cashier jockey costs thousands of dollars to train....

Citation? It does NOT cost thousands of dollars to train a temporary/seasonal or retail/cashier jockey. Stop making shit up.

[RandBlade]

Sure, and new employees are free and grow on trees.

Even a minimum wage cashier jockey costs thousands of dollars to train, whereas kind words and feigned concern are free, so workplaces that actually adhere to your if-they-don't-like-it-too-fucking-bad approach to employee morale may as well be burning piles of cash on the front lawn.

FFS, aren't you a manager? How do you not know this?

I do know that but it doesn't contradict what I said. I've always believed in treating people right, but I've also always believed that there's no point holding prisoners. For the welfare of both the individual and the company there's no point having someone miserable at work.

If you're that pissed off anyway getting you out sooner and replacing one individual is better than having someone poison the atmosphere meaning 5 people end up needing to be replaced.

[Loki]

citation?

Care to cite all the cases where doctors got punished for giving out sick notes without sufficient evidence of sickness? Once you're done, I'll cite all the people who've won a lottery.

[Ominous Gamer]

I was hoping you would at least try to justify your remark

The fact that there are more lottery winners than bad doctors isn't going to help your claim much.

[Enoch the Red]

I was hoping you would at least try to justify your remark

The fact that there are more lottery winners than bad doctors isn't going to help your claim much.

It certainly might help his case if the metrics you are using to judge doctor quality are based off rules that are seldom or laxly enforced.

[CitizenCain]

Citation? It does NOT cost thousands of dollars to train a temporary/seasonal or retail/cashier jockey. Stop making shit up.

Look, one of us has a degree from a college of business and one of us believes that evil Republikan j00s want to invade her vagina. You stop making shit up.

And I won't expect that citation any time soon either, because I'm not going to even the waste the time a Google search would take so I can hear back from you about how whatever citation I come across is part of the j00spiracy or a lie to aid in the 0pression 0f the k0mm0n man or irrelevant because the Republikans are sending k0mmand0 teams to occupy your uterus or what the fuck ever other painfully mind boggling piece of insanity you've got stored up.

I do know that but it doesn't contradict what I said. I've always believed in treating people right, but I've also always believed that there's no point holding prisoners. For the welfare of both the individual and the company there's no point having someone miserable at work.

If you're that pissed off anyway getting you out sooner and replacing one individual is better than having someone poison the atmosphere meaning 5 people end up needing to be replaced.

Fair enough... and certainly true that unhappy, toxic employees have their own costs associated with them as well.

[RandBlade]

One odd example about "the door's there" is a temporary one. We don't actually have that much snow at all in the UK, a few little flakes and some go hysterical though. I've been involved with my company now for 7 years and one important part of it involves a lot of people driving on the roads. For the first few years we followed the rulebook (written in America) which states that in "inclement" weather if the road conditions reach a point where the manager deemed it was deemed unsafe to drive then he should take the drivers off the road. The problem is that judgement call varies, so we'd have some (often the usual suspects) wanting to take the night off at the first snow-flake, while others I swear would drive through a blizzard. First few winters then it never reached the point it was unsafe to drive and so if somebody spoke to me and said they weren't sure about driving I'd try and talk them into driving (not force them though and not make it a disciplinary issue if they refused, which they didn't). Those people would just moan to the other drivers though and so you'd get more reacting.

2 winters ago a real blizzard did hit and after a couple of people requesting it I made the call that we would stop driving and called all locations and told their managers to get their drivers back into the building.

Next day we changed policy - It would no longer be upto the manager. If any driver thought for any reason the road conditions weren't safe then they would be allowed to go home (or stay inside) for the night, simple. In hindsight, that should always have been the policy I think, that was a learning. But since then we've faced much worse weather sometimes than the first few years without anywhere near as much concern raised by people - they are happier knowing its their decision, that we'll respect their choice. Also without anyone unhappy there, the rest are happy to just get on with it. Most people who know how to drive can and have driven in light snow before and by not telling anyone to it removes it as a concern.

[Loki]

I have noticed that people in England get scared from seeing a centimeter of snow on the road. It's kind of ridiculous.

[RandBlade]

<Modhat>Cain I think that sort of language is uncalled for</Modhat>

[Loki]

*steals hat and runs off*

[Nessus]

Plot of Thor 2?

[Khendraja'aro]

Plot of Thor 2?

Doesn't have quite the same ring as "The theft of Mjölnir".

I mean, "Where in the world is Odin's hat?"

Could be a Monty Python skit, though.

[Loki]

I'm pretty sure the Thor franchise is allergic to plots.

[Khendraja'aro]

I'm pretty sure the Thor franchise is allergic to plots.

I wouldn't be quite so sure about that. Granted, it's not exactly high literature, but sometimes even Marvel has some interesting stuff going on.

For instance, there was a mini series about the conflict between Loki and Thor - with Loki (seemingly) finally gaining the upper hand, incarcerating Thor. Loki, first drunk with joy, realizes after quite a while that the conflict with his sibling is an eternal circle. And that, to truly gain freedom, he needs only to make peace with his brother to break the cycle.

Only, when he rushes to his brother's prison to free him, he discovers that Thor has already broken his shackles and is thirsting for his blood. Thor then kills Loki in his berserker rage, thus beginning the cycle anew


As I said, not high literature, but certainly a plot

[CitizenCain]

<Modhat>Cain I think that sort of language is uncalled for</Modhat>

Alright... in the absence of specifics, I'll do my best to make sure I avoid using the sort of language like "fair enough" again.

[Loki]

I wouldn't be quite so sure about that. Granted, it's not exactly high literature, but sometimes even Marvel has some interesting stuff going on.

For instance, there was a mini series about the conflict between Loki and Thor - with Loki (seemingly) finally gaining the upper hand, incarcerating Thor. Loki, first drunk with joy, realizes after quite a while that the conflict with his sibling is an eternal circle. And that, to truly gain freedom, he needs only to make peace with his brother to break the cycle.

Only, when he rushes to his brother's prison to free him, he discovers that Thor has already broken his shackles and is thirsting for his blood. Thor then kills Loki in his berserker rage, thus beginning the cycle anew


As I said, not high literature, but certainly a plot

I was referring to the movie franchise. I obviously agree that Loki is the coolest character in fiction.

[Nessus]

I was referring to the movie franchise. I obviously agree that Loki is the coolest character in fiction.

Them's fighting words, son

You ever read Sandman?

(Sorry about the OT)

[Loki]

I never got into comics, sorry. I also haven't read any fiction in about 6 years.

We should talk about the pensions given to comic book authors.

[Nessus]

Does Walt Disney's frozen head get a pension?

[Ominous Gamer]

sometimes even Marvel has some interesting stuff going on.

Family watched Black Panther last night. This is one of the episodes:


and they were solar powered.

[GGT]

Look, one of us has a degree from a college of business <snip>You stop making shit up.

And I won't expect that citation any time soon either, because I'm not going to even the waste the time a Google search would take so I can hear back from you about how whatever citation I come across is <snip> a lie <snip> or irrelevant....

I said, "It does NOT cost thousands of dollars to train a temporary/seasonal or retail/cashier jockey". It takes one or two 8 hour shifts of shadowing another employee to "train" many (if not most) minimum wage workers. Cashiers, dishwashers, landscape workers, inventory scanners and stockers ....they don't need a six month orientation program. Small and private businesses don't work that way.

Not all low-wage jobs mean a Big Box or large franchise, with a HR dept. or complicated new-hire SOPs. Maybe you're assuming burger-flipping means work at a McDonald's, pizzeria workers employed by Domino's, cashiers hired by Walmart, or that most housekeepers are in the hotel industry? If so, that's a false assumption.

Temporary and seasonal jobs are especially sensitive to local labor markets, and time-efficiency. Those employers won't/don't need to spend thousands of bucks on low-skilled worker 'training'. Especially now, when millions of people are out of work or unemployed long-term, and often take any job just to get some income.

Minimum wage workers are a dime a dozen, and easily replaced during tough economic times. Surely you know that, with your college business degree and all.

[Lewkowski]

so you don't trust doctors to perform within their profession, but you trust employers to not use health conditions as a way to reduce payroll or insurance costs?

yeah, thats logical

Who says I do?

There exists a mutually beneficial employer/employee relationship. If the employee ceases to benefit from the relationship they quit. Sounds fair right? If the employee ceases to benefit then... they fire the employee. Are you suggesting that an employer is required to keep an employee who is costing the company more than it is benefiting the company?

And in that case would the flip side be true? Should an employer be required to stay even if there are better opportunities elsewhere? I highly doubt that is your position.

[Ominous Gamer]

If the employee ceases to benefit from the relationship they quit.

[Lewkowski]

You doubt this? So if an employee gets another job offer with better pay/benefits they won't leave?

[Ominous Gamer]

If the employee ceases to benefit from the relationship they quit.

if an employee gets another job offer with better pay/benefits they won't leave?

These claims are not the same