In other words, the following was a little misleading:
Originally Posted by RandBlade
In other words, the following was a little misleading:
"One day, we shall die. All the other days, we shall live."
No.
Boris Johnson is a prime example of the type of Brit that thinks that just because they move in circles that reflect the old empire, they actually still have the kind of status that old empire bestowed. The truth is that the new kids on the block find the palaces and the Queen and the affectations kind of charming and utterly touristic. But when it comes down to business they don't give a damn about whether or not he was in the Bullingdon club or at Eton or that he is Her Majesty's secretary of state. Then they are aware of the fact he's on the asking side of an unequal negotiation, and all his buffoonery will not win him anything. It may loose his country a lot though, as the people with the real power, after all are just people who may be annoyed and let that weigh in on their decisions.
Since the membership of Turkey of the EU is not mr. Johnson's to decide upon I think he missed a prime opportunity to keep his mouth shut.
Congratulations America
Interesting, Nissan suggests that the UK could keep it investing in the UK if the government is willing to guarantee to compensate for any negative effects that Brexit may have on their trade with the EU. Sounds like a plan to me; Brexit subsidized cars for us.
Congratulations America
I'm wondering if Randblade writes shit for IDS. His Brexit plan is about as delusional as what Randblade usually writes on here.
Congratulations America
I've had a busy weekend working and not read anything from IDS, do you have a link? No I don't write anything for him, I don't normally like him but if you're calling him delusional then he might be quite rational.
Since this seems to becoming a Brexit megathread, we have the announcement coming today of a Great Repeal Bill and a date for Article 50 to be invoked by end of March next year. Now all of a sudden everyone on the British media and die hard remoaners are talking about this being a "very fast" timetable. It's almost bang on what I'd been predicting and what you were saying was too slow.
https://www.theguardian.com/politics...ech-delusional
I don't see any delay for elections in the EU. And of course it's too late given that the only aim is to talk before notification.
Congratulations America
It's been delayed nearly a year from the initial vote until 2 months before the French Presidential election. Meaning almost all of the 2 year window for negotiations is after the new President is in place.
Listening to May's speech she's either bluffing or preparing to quit the Single Market.
Little else she can do, given that we really meant what we said about free movement and having a second referendum would be political suicide.
I wonder if we'll impose a visa regime on British visitors.
Congratulations America
It's looking increasingly likely that Britain will just sign a generic trade agreement with the EU.
Hope is the denial of reality
Yes it certainly looks likely.
Visa restrictions on moving/work are quite possible. Visa restrictions on tourism there's not a snowballs chance in hell of happening.
Sooo, Rand, are you prepared to eat your words yet, Mr. "We want the cake and eat it, too"?
Seems like your PM at least has recognized that "access to the single market" and "no restrictions on movement of labour" are two sides of the same coin.
However, her statement on the votes of the regional parliaments of Wales, Scotland and Northern Ireland were a bit stupid - there's no better way to drive people into secession than to tell them that their voices don't matter.
When the stars threw down their spears
And watered heaven with their tears:
Did he smile his work to see?
Did he who made the lamb make thee?
I have always believed the only reason to have a cake is in order to eat it so not at all no. If we get a free trade deal then we will have access to the Single Market. That is the difference between access and membership.
As someone who has said here for many, many years it would be best for all concerned if Scotland goes independent I couldn't give less of a fuck if that feeds secession. In reality though Brexit makes secession much, much tougher for Scotland to achieve.
If the English football team changed the goal posts as frequently as do your politicians, they'd win every World Cup.
Hope is the denial of reality
Since we haven't won the World Cup in my lifetime that'd be progress.
Once again, it's important to consider what level of access to the single market we're talking about.
"One day, we shall die. All the other days, we shall live."
You won't have access without membership. Your PM recognizes that.
When will you?
...
Probably at the heatdeath of the universe.
When the stars threw down their spears
And watered heaven with their tears:
Did he smile his work to see?
Did he who made the lamb make thee?
America and South Korea have access to the Single Market. Anyone in the WTO does. Hence why I'm writing this post on a Samsung Android phone.
What is at issue is the level of access as Aimless rightly points out.
Hence the perception of jazz-dancing goalposts
"One day, we shall die. All the other days, we shall live."
And if these were the goalposts before the Brexit vote, how many pro-business types would have supported it?
Hope is the denial of reality
Who knows? I'm a businessman. It depends what industry you're in I guess.
Also, tariff free trade is still a gargantuan headache compared to trading inside the single market. For Nissan even with compensation the UK no longer may be attractive.
Congratulations America
Riiiight. Because that's what you meant by "access" - border levies and custom duties up the wazoo. Plus, customs control - if you don't adhere to our standards your goods won't even cross the border. Which means that if you want to sell to us you still have to follow our rules. Too bad.
Say, are you pathologically this mentally challenged or do you just ignore countries like Norway ans Switzerland which, for some reason, didn't want that kind of "access" you're waffling on about now? Also, if this kind of "access" is oh-so-great, why are we talking about TTIP and CETA?
Yes. Thought so.
When the stars threw down their spears
And watered heaven with their tears:
Did he smile his work to see?
Did he who made the lamb make thee?
Nissan are the boy who cried Wolf when we didn't join the Euro.
I think we can and should get a deal without tariffs or duties. That is the free trade deal I would be looking for.
Yes absolutely any exports to the EU would need to follow EU standards just as any exports to America follow American standards and exports to Japan follow Japanese standards. Not sure what your point is, this isn't news.
We are talking about TTIP and CETA as those are free trade deals which is what we want. Without any of the Federal bullshit the EU wants to have on top of trade.
Not joining the euro is an administrative nuisance. Border controls can mean cars can't be built or delivered. Entirely different magnitude.
Fyi May's speech wasn't front page news in Holland.
Congratulations America
I highly doubt Germany is going to want to prevent BMWs being exported to the UK.
Wouldn't expect our PM's speech to be front page news in other countries. Yours isn't here either. Kind of why it makes sense to have your own body politic deciding your own laws.
If only we lived in the 19th century, when this kind of narrow-minded thinking still worked.
Hope is the denial of reality
Narrow minded to believe in democracy? If you say so.
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